Trick Diagnosis

Why does your Ollie turn?

Symptom

In Ollie, your board turns.

Why does your Ollie turn? They say it is in your shoulders, but if your board turns even when you align your shoulders with your board, there must be other causes besides the shoulders. This time, we will scientifically breakdown the turning Ollie problem.

How to use

Welcome to the trick diagnosis system.
Please follow the steps and diagnose your symptoms.

Inspection

Please upload a video below and self-diagnose yourself.
Then, answer the questions next in the next section.

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Questions

Please describe your symptoms from below.
A personal chart will be tailored for you.

Angle of Shoulders

While the shoulder angle is often said to be the primary factor in the turning problem, "rotating your shoulders in the middle of an Ollie" and "Ollieing with your shoulders open" are entirely different. Please use the Inspection tool and the HINTs to choose applicable symptoms.

Q. Does your shoulder angle open up in the middle of the ollie compared to the crouching position?

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Q. Are your shoulders already open from the squatting position and remain open throughout the entire Ollie motion?

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Position of Weight

Having your center of gravity on the heel side could turn your board even with your shoulders completely parallel to your board. Please use the Inspection tool and the HINTs to see where your center of gravity is. Then, choose the symptoms that apply to you.

Q. Does your hip and center of gravity move toward the heel side?

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Q. Does your Ollie often rocket or not level?

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Angle of Feet and Knees

The angle of the feet is not a significant cause of the turning problem. However "placing feet open crouching" and "opening ankles and knees in the air" are different and could turn your board in some cases. Please select applicable symptoms.

Q. How is the angle of your front foot when you crouch? Do you place it open?

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Q. Where do you place your back foot? Do you place it on the toe or heel side instead of the center of the tail?

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Q. Are your feet and knees open when you slide your front foot up in the air?

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Practice Methods

You could also turn your board when doing Ollies over obstacles or while holding onto something. Check the options if applicable.

Q. In what situation does your board rotate? Is it while Ollieing over an obstacle?

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Q. In what situation does your board rotate? Is it while practicing Ollies while holding onto something?

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Movement of Board

Please look at the movement of your board closely and see when and how it moves. It might associate with hidden symptoms.

Q. When does your board rotate? Does it rotate "before" the peak of an Ollie?

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Q. When does your board rotate? Does it rotate "after" the peak of an Ollie?

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Difference in gears

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Diagnosis

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Common Symptoms

The following could cause the problem you selected.
Please use the personal chart section, too.

Common Symptoms

The following could cause the problem you selected.
Please use the personal chart section, too.

Angle of Shoulders

Q. Does your shoulder angle open up in the middle of the ollie compared to the crouching position?

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Breakdown

If your shoulders rotate from the crouching position to the point where you extend your body, you will generate a rotational force, causing your board to rotate. One reason that could cause this problem is when you pull back your front arm, which could block your sight, in an attempt to concentrate on sliding up your front foot. Although pulling your front arm to the heel side makes it easier to see the movement of your front foot, it also generates a rotational force, and you have to avoid pulling it backward.

Solution

When lifting your arms, spread them out to the sides. Doing so allows you to pressurize both your feet evenly and lift your body efficiently without generating a rotational force. You will also have a clear vision of your front foot.

If you are unsure if you have this symptom, check when your board begins to rotate in your Ollie. If your upper body rotation causes this problem, your board should have begun to rotate by the time it reaches the peak of your Ollie. Since your body has already generated a rotational force on the way up, your board will also rotate while going up from the ground. Of course, your board will continue to rotate after the peak due to inertia, but note that it differs from a symptom where "your board starts to rotate after reaching the peak," which we discuss in another case.

Q. Are your shoulders already open from the squatting position and remain open throughout the entire Ollie motion?

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Breakdown

As explained in the previous video, it is possible to Ollie straight with open shoulders. If you keep your shoulder angle throughout your Ollie, no rotational force will act on your body that could turn your board. So, having your shoulders open at a comfortable angle does not necessarily turn your board.

Solution

However, if you contract your body in a twisted position, the twisting of your body will gradually move back to its original position. On the other hand, if you are still new to Ollies, your board should turn even if you don't pull your feet so close to your chest. In that case, the cause is somewhere other than the angle of your shoulders.

Position of Weight

Q. Does your hip and center of gravity move toward the heel side?

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Breakdown

If you are afraid of doing an Ollie, you may unconsciously pull your body away from your board or do an Ollie with your hip pulled back so that you can get off your board immediately. Your weight shifts to the heel side by pulling your hip, and your front foot must move under the center of gravity before landing. In an Ollie, your front foot, which you push forward to level your board, moves toward the heel side to support your weight and turns your board.

Breakdown

The trouble is it's difficult to notice you are pulling your hip because, in most cases, you can keep your body's center of gravity directly above your board when you squat and store energy to jump up. Since your weight shifts to the heel side by pulling your hip, you must tilt your chest forward to offset the weight to balance over your board. When jumping, you must raise your chest, which is initially on the toe side and later moves to the heel side, pulling the center of gravity to the heel side.

Solution

To solve this problem, practice moving your center of gravity vertically up and down while slowly moving straight ahead. At first, you do not even need to pop. You can say you are not pulling your hip if you can move your body up and down without swaying it back and forth. Once ready, try popping lightly while moving straight ahead, keeping your body axis over your board. And avoid popping too hard. You can always go for higher Ollies after getting used to it.

You can tell you are pulling your hip if your board turns after your Ollie reaches the peak. It is because you don't generate any force to rotate your board until your Ollie reaches its peak with your body's center of gravity above your board when crouching, and you are not turning your shoulders. Note that it is your front foot that turns your board in an attempt to support your weight after reaching the peak.

Q. Does your Ollie often rocket or not level?

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Breakdown

If you pull your front foot up too high without lifting your center of gravity, a similar symptom to pulling your hip occurs. If you lift the center of gravity high enough, you can adjust how high you lift your front foot to an extent. On the other hand, if you lift your front foot too high while your center of gravity stays low, you will crush your body and push your hip to the heel side. As a result, the center of gravity also moves to the heel side, and the front foot moves toward the heel to support your body weight.

Breakdown

If your Ollie rockets or your back foot comes off your board, that'd indicate you're pulling up your front foot too high. In an Ollie, you use your front foot to push the nose, which comes up in an arc, and accelerates the force of the board's center of gravity comes up. In other words, you have to suppress the force of the nose to help the board's center of gravity come up.

Breakdown

However, if you lift your front foot too high, you will be dragging your board all the way until your Ollie reaches the peak. Not only can you not accelerate the board's center of gravity to come up, but your back foot will lose contact with your board as it angles too much. Furthermore, trying to pull up your front foot too high could push your hip to the side and turn your Ollie. So, suspect this symptom if your Ollie rockets and turns.

Solution

Practice lifting the center of gravity sufficiently. Your Ollie gets higher by lifting your body's center of gravity, not only by lifting your front foot. Make sure to lift your body by pressing down on both feet evenly, then adjust the force to pop the tail and how high you raise your front foot.

Angle of Feet and Knees

Q. How is the angle of your front foot when you crouch? Do you place it open?

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Breakdown

There is nothing wrong with placing your front foot open. As it might sound extreme, if it is really better not to angle your front foot against your board, that should mean you should place it perpendicular to your board. However, have you ever seen anyone do that? It was an extreme example, but the point is the ideal angle of the front foot should differ depending on your body.

Breakdown

If you think about it from a biomechanical point of view, it should make more sense. If you have flexible ankles and can crouch with your heels on the ground, you may be able to Ollie with your ankles perpendicular to your board. However, if you have fatally stiff ankles like mine, you may find it easier to stabilize your body by squatting with your feet open.

Breakdown

Let's break it down a bit more. First, to Ollie, you must lower your center of gravity to store the energy you need to jump up. It would be best to crouch steadily to avoid shifting the center of gravity to the heel side. If your ankles are stiff and placed at a 90-degree (or near-90-degree) angle to your board, you will end up standing on your toes, making it harder to balance.

Breakdown

If your ankles are stiff, they don't bend forward, and you must lower your body by tipping your knees inward while placing your feet open. In other words, to lower your body steadily, you must adjust the angles of your feet according to the stiffness of your ankles. This is why placing the ankle open is better for some people.

Breakdown

Also, you may think sliding up your front foot open will rotate your board, but you don't have to worry about it because the force of the nose to lift pushes the front foot back. It is vital to understand the FORCE OF THE NOSE TO LIFT is proportional to HOW HARD YOU POP THE TAIL. You would try to Ollie as high as possible and pop the tail with all your strength using your legs, back, and arms. Is your front foot's muscle stronger than the nose holding that energy? I am sure it is not. Your front foot should roll properly by being pushed back by the nose.

Solution

The angle of your feet has no direct relation to the turning problem, so adjust their angles according to the stiffness of your ankles so that you can crouch firmly.

Q. Where do you place your back foot? Do you place it on the toe or heel side instead of the center of the tail?

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Breakdown

The back foot's placement does not directly cause the turning problem, either. I often hear that you should place the ball of your foot in the middle of the tail, but can you even tell where it is with your shoes on? Your front foot receives the most friction with your board after popping the tail and determines your board's angle. In other words, if you keep your front foot in the direction of travel, your board will not rotate.

Solution

However, placing your back foot on the side could make your body axis lean forward and indirectly turn your board. If you pop the tail straight down with your weight on the toe side, you will apply a horizontal force to the tail on the heel side relative to your body and rotate your board and front foot. Therefore, there is nothing wrong with placing your feet in a position where you can balance comfortably, but you need to keep your body axis vertical to prevent the board from turning.

Q. Are your feet and knees open when you slide your front foot up in the air?

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Breakdown

Your board may rotate if you open your front foot or knee while sliding up. In an Ollie, your knee will be in front of the direction of travel, but it is not because you open it frontside. Instead, it is because your front foot moves backward relative to your knee as the nose arcs and pushes it back.

Breakdown

In a straight Ollie, your knee lifts almost vertically and stays in one place, serving as the fulcrum around which your front leg rotates. However, in most turning problems caused by the knee angle, you wind up opening your front knee outward to push out the nose instead of rotating your leg forward. This may be because we are not used to pushing our legs outward. For example, we often open our knees when we sit in a chair in our daily lives but rarely push our legs outward.

Solution

The only way to solve this symptom is to get used to the feeling of rotating the front leg. Slide up the nose while lifting your front knee vertically and avoid intentionally opening it. The same can be said when pushing the nose forward; do not open your knees intentionally, but push your leg forward around your knee.

One way to tell if you fall under this symptom is to check if your board is moving away from your back foot as it rotates around your front foot. Since this is not caused by the center of gravity shifting to the heel side, your weight does not shift from the direction of travel when seen from the front. Suspect this case if you are moving in a straight line throughout your Ollie, and your board loses contact with your back foot.

Practice Methods

Q. In what situation does your board rotate? Is it while Ollieing over an obstacle?

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Breakdown

Doing Ollies over obstacles could also turn your board. You can get over the obstacle if you Ollie with enough speed and pull up your back foot adequately. Getting the back truck to clear the obstacle is the most challenging part. You will rotate your board if you force the rear truck to move. Let's see what makes you want to do so individually.

Breakdown

One main reason is the body orientation and the direction of sight. In an Ollie over an obstacle, your body tends to face the direction of travel due to fear. In addition to this tendency, if you try to bring your back foot in your sight to see the movement of the rear truck, you will rotate your board.

Solution

Learn the feeling of pulling your back knee close to your chest. After clearing an obstacle, your eyes immediately direct the landing point, and you will often not see your back foot. Learn the feeling of how high you need to lift your back foot to clear the obstacle. But practicing pulling your back foot up can be dull, so try practicing Ollie into grabs. You may not be able to reach your board at first, but it is a great way to practice pulling up your knee, and, most importantly, it's fun.

Breakdown

The second cause is when you pop too far from the obstacle. If you rush into popping compared to a successful Ollie, your Ollie will reach its peak, and the tail will start to descend before it goes over the obstacle, increasing the chance of hitting it. As a result, you will have to push the rear truck forward to get it over the obstacle, making it rotate unintentionally.

Solution

Analyzing the board's physical behavior may help you hit the right timing to solve this problem. Because the nose lifts in an arc, the tip of the nose moves back compared to when it's going straight. With this concept in mind, wait until you reach close enough to the obstacle and pop right before it. Of course, avoid waiting too long, or the nose will hit the obstacle.

Breakdown

The third cause is when your approach is too slow. When moving too slowly, the rear truck will not have enough time to overcome the obstacle before starting to descend and eventually hit it when it lands. This makes you want to push your back foot forward to get the rear truck to clear the obstacle, only to rotate your board. Notice the farther it gets away from the center of gravity, the more it rotates.

Solution

If you're, for example, stepping on an obstacle, you'd fall under this symptom. To solve this, get used to doing Ollies with some speed. Don't worry about the height. You could also get used to the speed by practicing tricks over lines on the ground or practicing tricks off ramps.

Q. In what situation does your board rotate? Is it while practicing Ollies while holding onto something?

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Breakdown

The fact that your board can rotate even when your shoulder angle is perfectly parallel to your board while holding onto something proves that shoulder rotation is not the only cause of the turning Ollie problem. You may easily pull your hip back while holding onto something. As a result, as in the previous example, you will end up rotating the board as your front foot slips under your center of gravity to support your weight before you land.

Solution

As before, practice lifting your center of gravity vertically while moving slowly forward. Although practicing while holding onto something may help you learn to pop and slide up your front foot, it tends to cause your center of gravity to deviate to the heel side. I recommend practicing Ollies while moving as much as possible, no matter how slow it is.

Movement of Board

Q. When does your board rotate? Does it rotate "before" the peak of an Ollie?

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If your board rotates from the moment you pop until you reach the peak of your Ollie, it indicates a rotational force acts on your body immediately after popping. Please refer to this part and related solutions.

Q. When does your board rotate? Does it rotate "after" the peak of an Ollie?

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If your board does not rotate immediately after popping and starts rotating after reaching the peak, the position of the center of gravity may be the cause. This is because the front foot tries to slide under the center of gravity to support the weight. Please refer to this part and related solutions.

Opening your legs and knees when sliding your front foot up could also rotate your board in the later part of an Ollie. Please refer to this part and related solutions.

Difference in gears

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